Wisconsin Conservation Congress Executive Council
St. Point Holiday Inn
Jan. 08, 2010
Meeting was called to order by Chr. Edgar Harvey at 9:05 A.M. Roll call was taken by Sec. Kirchmeyer. Those present from the Ex. Council were, Richard Kirchmeyer. Joe Weis, Ray Smith, Al Brown, Roger Sabota, Mike Riggle, Arold Ninneman, Mark Noll, Mark Schultz, Dave Puhl, Stan Brownell, Dale Mass, Dick Koerner, Ed Harvey, John Edelblute, Mike Rogers, Lee Farney, Ken Risley, Al Phelan, Al Shook, Rob Bohmann, Jim Wrolstad. Those excused were Wade Jeske and Jo Ann Kuharske.
Also present were DNR liaisons Kurt Thiede and Kari Zimmerman. There were many other quests, some congress delegates, DNR personnel, authors of resolutions and interested sportsmen. They are as follows; Scott MaCully, George Bartels, Tony Blatler, Frank Reith, Tony Grabski, Scott Zimmerman, Tim Andryk, Ken Riesley, Scott Loomans, Jeff Pitzel, Tom Van Horn, Chief Warden Randy Starks, Tim Schuts, Dave Miller, Wes Dominee, Steve Oestreicher, John Olson, Al Lobner, Kendal Durham, Mike Staggs, Ron Kulas, Tom Hauge, Bill VanderZowen, Todd Schaller, and Steve Avelallemont.
There were no agenda repairs or corrections.
Chr. Harvy gave a short update on what has happened since the council last met.
Kurt Thiede WCC liaison also gave a report.
Kari and Kurt gave a presentation on responsibilities of comm., chairs, v. chairs, cochairs and sec. A review of Roberts Rules of Order and how important they are when conducting a meeting.. They then gave a very good presentation on Wisconsin’s Open
Next agenda item was the WCC’s 2010 proposed spring hearing questions.
#1 Lead reduction in fishing tackle.
Motion by Shook 2nd by Puhl to advance to the spring hearing
Mass wondered what would happen to those people who like to make their own lures..
He would like more info on what lures could be made of other that lead by spring hearing. MOTION CARRIED
#2 Youth bear hunt
Motion by Kirchmeyer 2nd by Smith to advance to the spring hearing.
Shook wondered how many permits would be available per management zone.
Riggle thought that many more people would apply and make the wait to receive a harvest permit would take much longer.
Rogers stated he really didn’t care who harvested the bear as long as it was done legally.
Kirchmeyer responded to the questions. The permits would be divided in each management zone by bear populations or evenly per management zone. The amount of youth that would be starting to apply would not be much of an increase because if they were interested in bear hunting they already would probably be applying. MOTION FAILED
#3,4,5,6,and7 Motion was made by Phelan 2nd by Rogers to act on questions 3,4,5,6,and 7 as a group and advance them to the spring hearing. MOTION CARRIED
#8 Increase over winter goals on deer by 25% Motion by Bohmann 2nd by Sabota to advance to the spring hearing. MOTION CARRIED
#9 No change to DMU’s from 2009
Motion was made by Risley 2nd by Phelan to advance to the spring hearing. MOTION CARRIED.
#10 Allow group bowhunting for antlerless deer in CWD zone.
Motion was made by Phelan 2nd by Wrolstad to advance to the spring hearing. MOTION
#11 Game farm owners to reimburse DNR for expenses.
Motion was made by Wrolstad 2nd by Ninneman to advance to the spring hearing.
#12 Quartering of deer (DNR has question also)
Motion was made by Shook 2nd by Puhl to advance to spring hearing. A motion to amend was made by Wrolstad to only advance if the DNR didn’t put the question on their portion of the questionnaire. 2nd was made by Weis. MOTION TO AMEND WAS CARRIED. MOTION TO ADVANCE WAS THEN CARRIED.
#13 3 Year moratorium on no EAB and HC
Motion was made by Schultz 2nd by Wrolstad to advance to the spring hearing Schultz The DNR estimates deer the deer herd, they don’t count them.
Bohmann made an amendment to the question to include the CWD zone. 2nd was made by Risley.
Noll This was not supported by the Big Game comm. many people outside of the CWD zone don’t care about that zone and the deer in the CWD zone will still die of the disease.
Farney attended the CWD sub comm. and the DNR suggested that they may need to reduce deer numbers in the areas surrounding the CWD zone to protect the rest of the state.
Noll is scared of the spread of the disease; many people are being selfish and are protecting deer.
THE AMENDMENT TO THE MOTION FAILED. 6 YES 12 NO
#14 Concept of antler restrictions.
Motion was made by Bohmann 2nd by Riggle to advance to the spring hearing.
Ninneman knows the author and he is a private land owner. In the authors area there is a very good percentage of public land.
Shook commented that there already is an antler restriction which is 3 inches.
Koerner said he has hunted for over 60 years and he remembers when there were antler restrictions and he opposes this restriction now. Hunters should be able to shoot what ever they want.
Noll Is the state ready for mandatory QDM?
Phelan this concept and idea has been around for some time.
Riggle some groups were promoting this on the ALT. E.A.B. comm. MOTION CARRIED. 12 YES 8 NO
#15 Archery buck lisc.
Chr. Harvey read a letter from the WBH which asked the WCC not advance this question so they could discuss and work on the issue.
Motion was made by Sabota 2nd by Ninneman to advance to the spring hearing.
Edelblute asked what kind of permits bow hunters had before.
Noll many parts of the state are does are shot off now, also don’t really know why they should be able to shoot an antlerless deer and an antlered deer when people are complaining they are not seeing any deer.
Mass asked how many WBH members are on the Big Game Comm.
Puhl Gun hunters out number bow hunters on the Big Game comm. Maybe the DNR could suspend giving the bow hunters an antlerless permit now and when the deer herd has recovered they could get the permit back.
MOTION REJECTED 9 YES 10 NO
#16 Requiring secondary gates on cervid farms
Motion was made by Bohmann 2nd by Koerner
Farney asked what would it accomplish right now there is a farm with double gates and they don’t close the second one. MOTION CARRIED
#17 Allow ID of ownership of ice fishing shelters using DNR customer numbers Motion was made by Smith 2nd by Koerner to advance to spring hearing.
LE commented that the DNR now allows traps to be tagged with customer ID MOTION CARRIED
#18 Legalize .41 and .44 caliber pistol rounds in long gun deer hunting shotgun zones.
Motion was made by Mass 2nd by Koerner to advance to spring hearing.
Noll More confusion would be added to the regulations for hunters
Smith made an amendment to the motion to add .357 Mag. 2nd by Mass
Smith noted that would give a person all possibilities of available calibers.
Shook We now can use pistols in shot gun zones this would also allow in rifle zones.
Rogers The .44 is also available in rifles.
Weis. Why can you use hand guns in shot gun zones and not rifle zones is it because of the distances the shot gun can shoot?
Mass Newer muzzle loaders now can shoot 200-250 yards and they are used in shot gun zones.
Koerner Most people hunt from elevated stands so it is much safer.
Noll Why don’t we just legalize rifles state wide?
MOTION TO AMEND CARRIED ORIGINAL MOTION AS AMENDED CARRIED. 15 YES 5 NO
#19 Use of blinds on state owned and managed lands.
Motion reject was made by Mass 2nd by Riggle.
Rogers Who would make the judgment call if a blind is active or not?
Weis This would be privatizing of public lands.
Sabota People would be staking out territory.
Shook This will cause fights like we already have with water fowl blinds.
Noll Some people may place blinds near others just to irk them, we don’t need any more conflicts amongst hunters. MOTION CARRIED
#20 Applications for fisher, otter and bobcat harvest permits.
Motion was made by Bohmann 2nd by Wrolstad to advance to spring hearing. Kirchmeyer amended to remove bobcat from question. 2nd was made by Riggle.
Puhl asked Zimmerman if the fur harvest comm. would have a problem with removing the bobcat from the question. He wasn’t sure.
Kirchmeyer added that not all applicants were trappers and others would have to buy a small gamer license just to apply for a bobcat permit. THE AMENMENT TO THE MOTION CARRIED. THE ORIGINAL MOTION THEN CARRIED.
#21 Allow the hunting of predators over bait.
Motion was made by Ninneman 2nd by Shook too advance to spring hearing.
Rogers Mich. allows this practice now. May get more people involved in varmint hunting. Eagles and hawks will be attracted to the bait.
Noll Would there be a limit set on the amount of bait?
Mass Concerned about the placement and the removal of such baits after the season is over.
Shook Some people may have a problem of identifying legal game.
Ninneman Some states have been allowing this practice for many years.
Bohmannn made a motion to delete the last sentence. 2nd by Edelblute Harvey Would this allow the moving of carcasses s in the CWD zone? AMENDMENT TO THE MOTION CARRIED. ORIGINAL MOTION THEN CARRIED.
#22 Preseason marking of trap sites.
Motion was made by Shook 2nd by Puhl to advance to spring hearing
Weis Can counties regulate this on their own lands?
Motion to amend to change some wording in the history and the question was made by
Weis 2nd was made by Wrolstad AMENDMENT TO THE MOTION CARRIED. ORIGINAL MOTION THEN CARRIED.
#23 Closing the spring beaver season.
Motion was made by Wrolstad 2nd by Rogers to advance to the spring hearing.
Puhl This is necessary to trap beaver on trout streams.
Schultz There are lots of beaver on the Miss.
Rogrers Stated he likes to trap beaver but in his area there are no beaver left.
Weis There isn’t any water in the north for the beavers to dam up many streams.
MOTION CARRIED 16 YES 4 NO
#24 Funds for Great Lakes fisheries
Motion was made by Mass 2nd by Weis to advance to the spring hearing. MOTION CARRIED.
#25 General Purpose Revenue to fund our commercial fishing industry.
Motion was made by Mass 2nd by Sabota to advance to the spring hearing. MOTION CARRIED
#26 Appointment of the DNR sec.
Motion was made by Phelan 2nd by Shook to advance to the spring hearing. MOTION CARRIED.
#27 Prohibit hunting of cervids within fenced enclosures in Wisc.
Motion was made by Shook 2nd by Puhl to advance to the spring hearing.
Riggle Whether you like fenced hunts the DNR regulates these facilities. Many farms make a living raising deer and having fenced hunts.
Edelblute Because of some these bigger farms fencing once hunt able land by the public now is no longer available to be hunted.
Noll Fenced in hunts is not hunting they should just call it shooting.
Risley We shouldn’t be able to tell some one what they can or can’t do it’s free enterprise. MOTION FAILED
#28 Non-resident 2 day fishing lisc.
Harvey There is a bill # AB577 which is asking for a 1 day non resident fishing lisc. This if passed could cost the DNR $470,000 in lost revenue if this bill passes. Motion to reject was made by Mass 2nd by Noll not to advance to the spring hearing. MOTION CARRIED.
#29 Lisc. reduction and exemptions for seniors and disabled persons.
Motion was made by Kirchmeyer 2nd by Puhl not to Advance to the spring hearing. MOTION CARRIED.
#30 Allow sports lisc. to be used for gun or bow hunting.
Motion was made by Shook 2nd by Kirchmeyer to advance to the spring hearing.
#31 Allow unattended open water decoys on private waters.
Motion was made by Edelblute 2nd by Koerner to advance to the spring hearing.
Noll Is this question worth asking?
Edelblute Who is going to make the judgment call on what waters are private or not?
Motion to advance to spring hearing REJECTED.
#32 Legalize 8 gauge shot guns with 10 gauge chamber inserts for water fowl.
Motion was made by Shook 2nd Koerner to advance to the spring hearing.
Authors comments: Many people would like to use vintage guns, you can use some modern ammunition, would use non-toxic shot.
Shook These shells are expensive.
Rogers How would the rechambering affect the shot pattern? Author; Not enough to worry about.
Ninnmeman Does it affect the range of the shot. No
#33 Allow harvest and use of bait on Miss. River and tributaries.
Motion was made by Noll 2nd by Puhl to advance to spring hearing.
Authors comments: This is a tradition, no VHS on the river, let people trap bait on the river and use the bait on the river.
Farney Would LE have a problem enforcing this?
LE. We wouldn’t be able to tell if the bait came from the river or else where.
Noll This is a huge resource used by many people.
Schultz This is very strong and old tradition in this area. MOTION CARRIED.
#34 Lower crossbow eligibility to age 55
Motion was made by Mass 2nd by Wrolstad to advance to the spring hearing.
Authors comments: It cost him a lot of money to get his wife’s cross bow permit.
Shook People as they get older it becomes harder to pull back a compound bow, and there is no reason why you shouldn’t be able to use one.
Phelan Advocates say it’s such an advance weapon.
Motion to amend by Phelan 2nd by Bohmann to take out the word advanced.
Motion to amend the amendment by Farney 2nd by Rogers to add alternative where advanced was. MOTION ON THE 2ND AMENDMENT CARRIED. MOTION ON THE ANMENDMENT CARRIED. MOTION CARRIED.
#35 Turkey preference for first time hunter’s ed. Graduates.
Motion was made by Smith 2nd by Rogers to advance to the spring hearing.
Shook 29-30,000 hunter ed. graduates per year. MOTION REJECTED
#36 Creation of a uniform statewide open hunting signs.
Motion was made by Puhl 2nd by Shook not o advance to the spring hearing. MOTION CARRIED NOT TO ADVANCE TO SPRING HEARING.
#37 Use of metal detectors on state lands.
Motion was made by Mass 2nd by Puhl not to advance to the spring hearing. MOTION CARRIED NO TO ADVANCE TO SPRING HEARING.
#38 Stream access proposal.
Motion by Puhl 2nd was made by Brown not to advance to spring hearing. MOTION
NOT TO ADVANCE TO SPRING HEARING CARRIED.
#39 Land access program.
Motion was made by Weiss 2nd by Schultz to advance to spring hearing.
Kirchmeyer Who will make the evaluation of what excessive deer is?
Rogers Who will set the reduction in taxes if access was allowed? MOTION TO ADVANCE TO SPRING HEARING REJECTED.
#40 Extension of the inland trout season.
Motion was made by Kirchmeyer 2nd by Puhl not to advance to the spring hearing.
Reiter creates more opportunity to fish trout.
Kirchmeyer During this time some trout are spawning so they would be very susceptible to being caught. MOTION NOT TO ADVANCE TO SPRING HEARING FAILED.
Motion was made by Brown 2nd by Phelan to advance to the spring hearing. MOTION CARRIED.
#41 Open the Wis. inland trout one week prior to the regular fishing season.
Motion was made by Wrolstad 2nd by Brown to advance to the spring hearing. MOTION CARRIED.
#42 Overharvest of walleye on Silver Lake.
Motion was made by Weis 2nd by Phelan to advance to the spring hearing. MOTION CARRIED.
#43 Lowe daily bag limit on crappies north of HWY 8
Motion was made by Weis 2nd by Shook to advance to the spring hearing.
Authors comments: There is a decline in size and quantities of crappies, there are 2 waters north of HWY 8 that have different bag limits that what the state wide daily bag limit is.
Puhl Who would set the bag limits on lakes the DNR?
Shook In 2003 Minn. Reduced daily bag limits on crappies to 10, and average size has gotten bigger since then. MOTION CARRIED.
#44 Pattern Lake walleye regulations.
Motion was made by Weis 2nd by Ninneman To advance to the spring hearing. MOTION CARRIED.
#45 Musky size limit on Lake Redstone.
Motion was made by Smith 2nd by Wrolstad not to advance to the spring hearing.
Authors comments; Fishing guide. More fishing pressure on the lake because there is potential to harvest a trophy fish, good for the local economy, baitfish doing well, and DNR calls it a class A musky water.
Shook By raising the size limit you will not reduce the fishing pressure.
Rogers There is some local support.
Smith Not in favor he wants kids to be able to keep a fish.
Mass This will give an opportunity for more smaller fish to be handled and increase the chances of dead fish. MOTION NOT TO ADVANCE TO THE SPRING HEARING FAILED. A motion to advance to the spring hearing was made by Weis 2nd Puhl. MOTION CARRIED.
#46 Invasive species rules for fishing tournaments.
After much discussion this question was not written according to what the author had wanted not the warm water comm. meant to be advance. A motion was made by Weis 2nd by Bohmann to return the question back to comm. MOTION CARRIED.
#47 Removal of trophy muskie designation for Pelican Lake, Oneida co.
Motion was made by Shook 2nd by Wrolstad to advance to the spring hearing.
Authors comments; Local lake association, and township support, Native Americans spear the lake. (Legally 29 per year)
Bohmann We should raise the size limit to 40” state wide.
Weis State has put the state wide size limit of 40” on the back burner for one year.
Shook finally someone is asking for a size limit to be lowered.
Mass Supports lowering the size limit, the 50” size limit was in effect for 2 years.
#48 50” size limit for musky on Whitefish Lake ,Sawyer co.
Motion was made by Weis 2nd by Ninneman to advance to the spring hearing.MOTION CARRIED
#49 & 50 Sawyer co. Bass regulations.
Motion was made by Weis 2nd by Wrolstad to advance to the spring hearing.
Weis Author didn’t intend for a state wide management. Motion to amend was made by
Weis 2nd by Wrolstad. The amendment is to take out the word state and substitute it with
Sawyer co. MOTION TO AMEND WAS CARRIED. ORIGINAL MOTION CARRIED.
#51 Fishing season expansion on Chippewa Flowage Sawyer co.
Motion was made by Weis 2nd by Wrolstad to advance tot the spring hearing. MOTION CARRIED.
#52 Managing panfish as separate species.
Motion was made by Weis 2nd by Puhl to advance to the spring hearing. Motion to amend was made by Rogers 2nd by Puhl. The amendment is to add state wide in the question after the word categories. AMENDMENT CARRIED. ORIGINAL MOTION CARRIED.
Rogers suggested that resolution number ___________, that was rejected by the Warm
Water Study committee, should be reconsidered by the Exec. Council. He would like forwarded to the spring hearing. Motion by Roger s to forward to spring hearing 2nd was made by Fahrney.
Weis This was brought up before the WW comm. and rejected.
Wrolstad When are we going to quit protecting a species when there is no harvest available for consumption?
Rogers This is a god case to forward question to protect the species.
Puhl Is this the correct way to handle this question procedure wise?
Schultz The public is expecting us to discuss this.
Farney We must respect the decision made by the comm.
MOTION TO FORWARD TO SPRING HEARING REJECTED
Motion to recess was made by Sabota 2nd by Smith at 5:50p.m. MOTION CARRIED
Reconvene at 6:50p.m.
Sec. Matt Franks remarks
Passed the MENTORED HUNTING BILL
Estimated 10-12,000 10-11 year olds purchased lisc.
The DNR received $90,000 from vendor from the turkey lisc. fiasco which will be usedfor youth events.
Pitmann/Robinson funds receiving around $12 million usually this amount is around $8 million. The additional $4 million will be used to conduct research on deer and other needed studies.
The 75th annual North American Wildlife and Natural Resources Conference will be held in Milwaukee this year on March 22nd and 23rd. 22% increase in bear permits over 2009
Invasive species Really clamping down on ballast discharges.
Budget Things are looking better after several, cuts were made, there was no increase in lisc. fees in the past budget. We are holding some vacancies open at this time.
Warden recruit class for 2010 Start in June hopefully stationed in 2011.
A key fisheries staff person will be hired.
Fur bearer specialist will be hired.
We are filling most critical positions at this time.
Thanked the WCC for their leadership with the deer issues.
Bohmann Stakeholders group formed by the NRB was set up to fail. Hopes the DNR/NRB uses the WCC to facilitate such committees in the future. DNR needs to build public confidence in deer populations to succeed in managing the deer herd.
Farney Asian carp in Lake Michigan. Response; Asking for a 2nd electric barrier to be installed, need COR OF Engineers to activate electric barrier, needs to be an all out effort to stop the migration of the carp.
Koerner Rosendale farm Response; Manure (cow power) is a good source of energy, also making sure theystay in compliance with all regulations.
Chief Warden Randy Starks RemarksNow have 23 warden vacancies.
Hiring 10-14 new recruits this summer
26 wardens will be eligible for retirement by 2011.
Hunting Heritage Conference Feb. 19th -20th 2010 in Wausau
Water guards were very successful in stopping invasive species from being spread.
The Wildlife Compact is doing its job of catching people who have had their license. revoked.
2009 deer season had only 7 accidents which is 4th safest in history. In 1984 there were 60 accidents.
Mentored Hunting Program had no accidents with only one arrest made.(mentor was not within arms reach of youth).
15 hunter harassment citations written in the deer season..
#1 violation illegal baits 334 27% of all citations written
#7 No license Up 100%
Wardens need help from citizens to help make arrests.
Edelblute Can a felon by a license? YES
Kirchmeyer Youth expo in Wausau is it going to happen? Not sure yet, all the funds
needed for the event to happen have not been secured.
Tom Hauge Wildlife report
Looking back in time things are definitely better than in 1938 when you could only hunt deer in 30 counties and they had to be forked on one side or better.
The NTA annual convention is in Marshfield in August sponsored by the WTA.
Bobcat study is under way.
The use of state lands to raise illegal drugs is becoming prevalent.
Koerner Did the DNR plant cougars? NO
Phelan Stated he completed the deer hunting survey.
Risley Remarked about the questions on the deer registration slips.
Mike Staggs Fisheries ReportLake Puckaway fish die off 2,000 walleye died which is about 8-10% of the population.
The die off occurred because of a legal commercial rough fish harvest.
!996 a barrier was installed in the Chicago River to stop invasive species from leaving
Lake Michigan and entering the Mississippi not to stop invasive species from the
Mississippi getting into Lake Michigan.
Many cuts in fisheries but the DNR will still be able to handle any emergencies that popup.
The planting of trout and salmon are the hardest hit.
Trout and sturgeon stamp funds will still be used to fund those projects at full strength.
Bohmann Salmon Unlimited wants to work with the DNR to stock Lake Trout near the reef areas.1 year old fry will be stocked but not until 2o12 in that area, the Kettle
Morraine area fish hatchery is having operation problems.
Koerner. How is the chemical put in the water to kill the carp? It is dispensed from a boom stretched over the water and it naturally excretes out.
Mass The rough fish commercial harvesters are really only farming the carp, because they only put nets in the water with holes that will catch bigger carp so in this way they will always leave smaller carp which will leave plenty of carp in the water for the future harvest on that water.
Scott Loomans gave a report on the preliminary suggested wildlife questions for spring hearing.
A motion was made by Phelan 2nd by Bohmann to have the Ex. Council approve Chr.
Harvey attending the January NRB meeting and request that the DNR place a rule change question on the spring questionnaire to allow the use of archery equipment during the statewide deer firearm season using an archery license and be implemented for the 2010 deer season. MOTION CARRIED.
Mike Staggs gave a report on the questions the DNR is forwarding to the spring hearing dealing with fish.
Mass Motion to request that Chr. Harvey ask that the NR at the January board meeting enact question #75 from the 2009 spring hearings which was supported by the public. 2nd by Koerner MOTION CARRIED.
Koerner wants committees to test the waters on more of the questions that come from the spring hearings.
Phelan Would like to see the use of rifles for deer hunting state wide.
Farney WCC was asked not to lobby on certain subjects. Is this cleared up? YES
Rogers doesn’t like the fact that the legislators are involved in proposing new turkey seasons this circumvents the WCC. Groups are starting to buy up thousands of acres of land and controlling the deer however they see fit.
Brown Write Obey/Feingold on the Wolf issue if we want anything to happen.
Noll The deer herds will fluctuate they will rebound in time.
Risley The deer counters need to look at the SAK and also look at the whole process of estimating deer populations.
Shook praised the congress for the leadership it has taken on the deer issues and other projects.
Riggle Make a call to your legislators it does work. Let them know what you think.
Brownell We shouldn’t tear down what a committee has done with a resolution.
Wrolstad doesn’t like that some resolutions come back time after time.
Sabota Call your legislators.
Edelblute some committees need help in developing questions.
MOTION TO ADJOURN AT 10:05 P.M. BY Puhl 2nd by Weis MOTION CARRIED
Respectfully Submitted By; Richard Kirchmeyer Sec.